Updates from January, 2014 Toggle Comment Threads | Keyboard Shortcuts

  • John 8:46 am on January 7, 2014 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , LMFAO lived at Wonderland,   

    Candid Videos Of The Wonderland House 

    The pop group, LMFAO, have been featured on the blog before, since they lived in the Wonderland House about 4 or 5 years ago. I have not shared these particular videos however.

    In the following videos, you can see the interior of the house a bit better, the layout, etc. I could not find one of the backyard area.

    Warning: These guys are idiots.

    Something about that house has people half-dressed!

    And a video made out in the street:


    • criticextraordinaire 6:06 pm on January 7, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Man, I wish I lived n LA and had the money. I’d buy that house and restore it to its former glory, and run it as a Wonderland-themed B&B. 🙂

      • scabiesoftherat 11:22 pm on January 7, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        I’d go to that. I wish they would have done that at Sharon Tate’s house instead of tearing the thing down.
        The guy in the middle video? Couldn’t you just picture Josh Lucas grabbing him by the shoulders and chucking him through the second floor window like he did with that stereo component? I could.

        Very, very easily….

    • Bobby 1:50 am on January 8, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Well John I must say, “these guys are idiots” is a MAJOR understatement! Have to agree with Scabies, but I’d have been real happy to hear that the ghost of Ron or Billy had kicked them down that stairwell.
      Sure would be real nice to see Critic’s dream come to life rather than having to witness these asshats desecrate this sacred site.
      Is it just me or does the taller guy (middle video) resemble John Holmes just a tiny little bit?.. same sorta jaw-line and teeth. Holmes however got more pussy than these two combined ever will 😉 They should just stick to dry humping doors, dressing in their ‘ironic’ 80’s clown costumes & producing shitty disposable dance music. Rant over.

      • criticextraordinaire 7:22 pm on January 8, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        “Asshat… out the window!”

    • localarts 2:59 pm on January 8, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Only those guy could have defaced 8763. Where are Holmes, Diles and the rest of the killers when you really need them!

  • John 11:09 am on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

    Little Is Known About Barbara Lee Richardson 

    I have posted snippets of this info before in comments and stuff, but never in one big post. Hope you like.

    I emailed with Barbara’s cousin earlier in 2013. This is what she had to tell me:

    Barbara was very pretty and a blonde. I don’t have any photos but will check with fam and see if they have any that I can send. Not sure what the response will be. Her death was kind of hush hush (for obvious reasons details were not discussed) and very painful for her immediate family. As I remember, she was the apple of everyone’s eye until her late teens when she got into drugs. So sad. The last time I saw her was at a family wedding, she was probably 18 and we spoke only briefly. She was beautiful and kind, but already going down the rocky road. I was hoping to find out some info about her but not much on the internet.

    –Barbara’s cousin

    Barbara Lee Easton (Richardson). 1976 Senior Photo. Cordova High School, Rancho Cordova, CA.

    Barbara Lee Easton (Richardson). 1976 Senior Photo. Cordova High School, Rancho Cordova, CA.

    Blog note:  Barbara grew up middle class, and lived in a nice new neighborhood a block from her high school in Rancho Cordova. The Lee (her middle name) came from her dad, Leroy Easton. Barbara was known in the family as “Barbara Lee”. Her grandma and mother were also named Barbara. When 17 or 18, Barbara married a young guy from the Sacramento area named Walter Richardson. He is still alive, but I have no idea if he or she were the bad influence, or why they split up. It was a short marriage nonetheless. I would assume maybe that Barbara…well… who knows really. Sad story, I would love to talk to Walter. I have seen a late 1970s photo of him and he sure was a nice looking kid. I just think that Barbara liked the bad boys… like David Lind. After the murders, Barbara’s parents drove all night to L.A. with the false hope that their daughter was the one that survived. It was not to be.


    • Brandy 11:29 am on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Been awhile since I’ve had my fix and this did it thanks! Is love to see a picture that wasn’t a mugshot or a crime scene photo of Barbara. I’ve bored people on here before talking about my history so I won’t. But I couldn’t have easily ended up dead if I had been in the wrong place and/or with the wrong person. For that I’m grateful. Thanks John!

      • John 11:33 am on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Brandy, hit refresh on your browser. I just posted a pic of Barbara to today’s post.

      • John 12:05 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Also, when investigator and author Nils Grevillius told Kevin that he was working on the movie, Wonderland, Kevin asked him to please see if they could put some good true stuff about his dad in there. Luckily, with Lind’s testimony there was already some good stuff about Billy on paper. However, both Kevin and also Julia Negron did not seem to care for the movie. Why should they.

        • jimmy---chicago 2:00 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink

          If you read chucks book you will see that they took advantage of joys kindness and at least chuck admits it but julia seems to forget what chuck wrote.Oh also in rock star wife post she refers to person who discovered bodies with her as “B” in chucks book he says that person is bob fisher a song writer who was billy prestons partner (the 5th beatle) who helped write nothing from nothing leaves nothing

        • John W 3:37 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink

          Yes Jimmy… Bruce Fisher. Interesting angle on the story. Joy had the hots for Chuck, so different people-different viewpoints.

    • Mark C 2:21 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Wow!! That is a new twist on this amazing story, All the stuff I read about Holmes after this career was over, I can’t help but believe most if not every word Kevin said is the honest truth. Man it be nice if the whole true story come out on this case in one place. I guess that John’s hopefully goal for this site.

      Yes I can see Billy having the extra money for fancy guns very easy , Mainly if he was only not working for the last 10 months of his life this make sense to myself. Plus if not mistaken in this time period work site surprise drug test was not common at all, You lucky if they even tested for drugs during your 1st hiring physical. You could use drugs and still work daily that sadly was common, Coke was heavy in my area during that time period. You see workers walk up to you with ring around the nosey. I was lucky beer after work was my drug, I don’t know how many on this board know about Heavy Construction Work, But I worked Heavy equipment construction my whole life and them crane operators & crew come to a job site. Them guys a very lot of the time like 95% of the time are the highest paid people on the whole job site by far amounts.
      It not just hooking up to anything they want to and just lift it. There a whole lot of math involved and even wind speed & weather is involved in that day’s lift or not. Many days they knock off go home due to weather, Its a very highly regulated job by both State & Federal Gov.’s. even back in them days, My guess is truth be known, It’s over insurance reasons, because lot of times you working with way over million dollars worth piece of equipment. If something happens and your paper work don’t have all the ” i’s ” dotted and t’s crossed you lose your license to work. I know I watch them take 1 guys license one day after a accident & after hearings and all. I even had to testify, I didn’t want to but I had to or I go to jail myself, And that poor guy lost his license for life over wind gust & wind speed he had a history of making the same very mistake that happened that day. And we was left with a 1.7 million dollars worth of scrap iron that is my guess is Insurance bought us a new one or that what I heard happened in the end, The Crane Company bought us a new one.

      • John W 3:54 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Yes Mark, in an earlier robbery… According to Nils Grevillius: Billy, Ron and Dave Lind burglarized the home of a rich businesdman in the valley. It was a nice score. Only the maid was home at the time. The guys tied up the maid and put her in the bath tub or shower. Ronnie wanted to kill her, but cooler heads prevailef and Billy and Dave talked him out of that. This is what Dave’s brother told investigator Nils Grevillius.

    • localarts 4:58 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Holmes was the ultimate pile of dog shit! If he simply would have done what Billy asked him to do, the blood bath may have been avoided. Launius should have put a cap in Holmes and been done with it.

    • Mark C 6:39 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Thanks John W. ….Localarts I don’t want to sound cruel or anything but that might would been the very best .35 cent Ronnie would ever spent in his whole life.. In a way I do feel sorry for Holmes because porn crew got him hooked on Coke and then they just throw him to the side of the road and left him.. I read before porn Holmes didn’t even smoke pot. But when it comes to Holmes you just don’t know where the truth ends and the lie’s start with him.. But after having friends been hooked on that drug they all told me that drug was not that bad of a habit to quit. Few told me cigarettes are much harder to quit than coke. You just had in your own brain make yourself quit coke or you be so broke you could not afford it any more anyway one of the two.. What little I read Coke is really pretty simple to quit compared to something like Heroin or that new Meth out now days to quit.
      Sadly that put Mr. Holmes right back where its kind of hard to feel real bad for him about his own actions that he did to himself that greatly effected a very lot of other people around him…
      I am very far from a drug expert, My drug experiences are very limited to like one or 2 hits off Pot in high school & I thought every Cop in nation was after me. That about ended my whole drug career.
      I just wish I was like that with alcohol too..

      • criticextraordinaire 7:09 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Johnny possibly did society a favor. The gang was already conducting armed robberies and contemplating murdering the victims. Ronnie himself was a suspect in 27 murders according to the accounts of the day. How much more mayhem would he have launched if he had survived?

        • localarts 8:47 am on January 4, 2014 Permalink

          That case could be made for Launius but not Billy and the women. They didn’t deserve to die like that. Holmes himself would go on to knowingly and willing expose his “co workers” to the HIV virus, a death sentence in the 80″s. Had John Holmes been able to conceal his health for a longer period of time, how many more would he have exposed to the virus? Thank God AIDS took his life before he killed somebody else.

        • criticextraordinaire 12:45 pm on January 4, 2014 Permalink

          Hey, Billy was in on those robberies too, and according to the preliminary hearing transcripts, Joy and Babs were in on the planning sessions for the Nash hit. The only one who might get a pass would be Susan, as I do not believe that she was in on the planning. That said they ALL knew they were fraternizing with armed robbers. Hang around dogs… get fleas…

      • localarts 8:30 am on January 4, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        I agree, Mark. At the end of the day, the choices you make have consequences and Holmes refused to take responsibility. Nobody forced Holmes into porn or take drugs, those were decisions he made and he made alone and it would ultimately destroy him.

    • criticextraordinaire 6:39 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Billy kinda looks like Russell Crowe.

    • Jessi may 1:31 pm on January 4, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Hey.i was so happy to see u post,i been waiting.im amazed again with ur searching skills.i have a few questions…is that a tire on Ronnie’s bed? John, do you ever feel bad posting negatives things about the gang (i know they’re not a gang) after you spoke to people in their family? Once again i check for posts everyday and i’m super happy there are people into this like i am. I think i’ve read every post and the responses. I’ve learned a ton from the responses. Thanks again! P.S. I watched “wonderland” again last night and isn’t it a super awesome soundtrack? And Josh Lucas did great and would be good for the Ronnie movie.

      • kdimmick 12:39 am on January 5, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        LOL! You know,I too had always thought that looked like a small tire on Ronnie’s bed but it is actually a pillow…

      • scabiesoftherat 12:40 am on January 5, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        I was at work a few weeks ago when I came upon a newspaper article. In this newspaper article, the headline said somethin’, somethin’…”at the NASH”. (It was some kinda venue in town) Being a fan of the movie and interested in the actual story, I cut the words “the NASH” out of the newspaper and then promptly walked the words and a piece of scotch tape over to the time clock.

        I found my time card in my slot…and I then proceeded to tape “the NASH” over my very own name on the card.

        It took about a week,…but people actually started calling me Nash and started referring to me as “THE NASH”….with no real reason as to why they were doing it. (It’s such a Lemming quality. I love it.)

        I will walk into inspection to grab some paperwork and the one guy always says, ‘Hey, It’s the NASH!”. I always respond with,

        “You want the guns from the NASH,…huh, mudderf**k!….then try and take the guns from da NASH!…huh!!,…huh!!!”

        It’s a good way to kill time. I always just wish that I was only wearing a silk robe and “Whitey-Tighty-Fruit-Of-The-Looms” under it. That would make it complete.

        • John 9:22 am on January 6, 2014 Permalink

          That’s a great nickname!

    • Paul Russell 9:53 pm on January 8, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      I work as a school teacher now but was a drug and alcohol counselor in a youth detox/rehab for a number of years after completing my degree in youth studies. I undertook a lot of research into addictive behaviors and post graduate studies into addiction counseling. With all due respect to the comment by Mark C, Coke is highly addictive both physically and psychologically and crack is even more addictive for many (but not all) with very low recovery rates long term. The point I wish to make is this: comparing cocaine to nicotine or heroin to methamphetamine for the purpose of measuring ‘addictiveness’ is a moot point. A persons strength of addiction to any substance depends on what they ‘bring’ to that drug: their personality, history, needs, fears, childhood and current circumstances. Some people can drink in moderation, other cant. Holmes use of smokeable cocaine hydrochloride was clearly compulsive and would have had a massive impact on his decision making ability. Go 6 days without food or sleep and at most, 1 glass of fluid every 24 hrs and see what happens to your thinking process. To make drug use about simply ‘personal choice’ over simplifies a deeply complex area that researchers are only part way into understanding.

    • Mark C 4:46 am on January 11, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      No worry’s there Paul Russell, I really enjoy reading your post. honest.
      I live in WV Coal & Natural Gas fields.
      Just incase you want to study your profession little more you more welcome give myself a yell & I give you my personal e-mail address and YouTube video of some of more famous people in my area.
      From Hatfield’s from Hatfield’s & McCoy fame to Jessco White The Dancing Outlaw.

    • Jill C. Nelson 7:25 am on January 11, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Great post, Paul. Excellent insights and information. I’d like to add that the ‘addiction’ factor within the Holmes/Wonderland saga is one of the primary elements that had initially attracted us to this story. As far as I’m concerned, it’s THE major piece that is often left out of the equation when discussing Holmes and these events. Jennifer and I did a fair amount of research into the effects of cocaine/freebase upon individuals over prolonged periods and had originally implemented our findings into the bio. We later edited the information out because we felt that the interviewees’ comments, including the Holmes quotes, illiuminated the drug’s influences on the brain chemistry of a user in a far more dramatic fashion, ultimately making greater impact rather than stating/addiing it to the book in a clinical way. To us, it was glaring that John’s drug use had reached a point where it affected every single aspect of his life and the lives of others closest to him.
      In 1979, after wrapping up a film shoot, two of Holmes’s trusted friends, Joel Sussman and Bob Chinn, planned a spontaneous trip to Hawaii. It was an intervention of sorts — and they hoped that John would agree to come along. He did. Bob shared with Jennifer and I that he and Joel had become very concerned about Holmes and his spiraling drug use (which had grown into a massive addiction) so they devised a plan to to get him out of L.A. for a while in hope that he would get clean. During the three weeks they were away, John did get clean and started to feel like himself again. He fell in love with Chinn’s birthplace of Kauai and had wanted to remain on the island indefinitely. He even toyed with the idea of becoming a ‘pool boy’ at their hotel longterm. Sadlly, upon his return to L.A. he fell back into his addictive cycle and we all know what happened after that. In many ways, “Inches” is a cautionary tale that underscores the potential tragedy and fallout associated with chemical addiction.

      • Paul Russell 4:24 pm on January 12, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Hi Jill, something also interesting is the relationship between cocaine and people with a propensity for lying and exaggerating. Peter Criss ( drummer from the band Kiss), who has spoken about his own substance abuse issues, calls cocaine “the liers drug”. Lying and coke do seem to feed off each other- the more coke you do, the more lies you tell. Cocaine does seem to work on serotonin and nor adrenaline in a specific way that removes the usual self reflection that comes with lying: does everyone know im lying? Do I sound believable? Why do I keep lying? Cocaine appears to remove this uncomfortable process from the mind. It becomes a vicious cycle and its no surprise that Dawn said it was the one drug he could never kick. Being clean and drug free would be very uncomfortable for someone who has told such wild and excessive stories to people. In sober moments, Holmes would have known how stupid much of what he said sounded. Cocaine ( and to some degree amphetamines) appears to be unique in this way. Alcohol, Heroin, LSD and so forth dont seem to make lying or exaggerating attractive. Nor do those drugs alleviate feelings of self doubt or insecurity in the same way.

        • John 10:47 am on January 14, 2014 Permalink

          That is right on, about the lying part. My relatives are proof! My brother would lie to our faces, steal from us or “borrow money”, and then lie some more. But I guess that’s what addicts do. Nothing worse than someone asking to “borrow” $50 when you know damn well you will NEVER get it back, LOL.

    • localarts 1:07 pm on January 11, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Well said Jill.

    • Jill C. Nelson 7:12 am on January 12, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Thank you, localarts.

    • Jill C. Nelson 9:15 am on January 14, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      I certainly believe the cocaine/crack use exacerbated Holmes’ propensity to lie, though John had fabricated and embellished truth for years prior to his introduction to drugs. It was, in part, a survival tactic he’d honed from his childhood years onward and seemed to be connected to his own low self esteem, inferiority and insecurities more than anything else. As a kid growing up in a dysfunctional family system, John learned early how to hustle, lie, steal and perservere, as many (not all) children do when faced with unpredictability, cruelty and violence.
      Jennifer and I discovered while researching the bio that many, if not most of John’s lies were rooted in some degree of truth which is interesting and not really surprising. In Holmes’ situation, his “untruths” (as Bob Chinn referred to them) were a double-edged sword. He employed lies to impress, cover painful truths, inflate his ego, his sense of importance and to gain acceptance, but his ability as a spin doctor also brought to the table one of his most significant qualities — like it or not, John was a larger-than-life, charismatic individual. That quality made it easy for him to be manipulative, but also endearing and magnetic, which is probably one of the reasons most of the people who had known him well still speak fondly of him to this day.
      It is indeed a tragic story, and again, it’s a cautionary tale. John was not an inherently bad human being. When clear-minded, there were instances when he went above and beyond to help/save loved ones and friends.
      As a society, I think we’ve come a long way in thirty years since these events occurred and far more is known about addiction, its origins and effects today than during the Wonderland era. I believe that it is our responsibility to ourselves, to loved ones, and to our communities to recognize and remedy deficiencies in our lives. Easier said than done, I know, but we can always hope.

    • Jessi may 4:44 pm on January 16, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Omg…mark.im from wv too.closer to DC and Baltimore.Hope ur water is ok.

    • mark c 12:59 am on January 17, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Thanks Jessi
      I am a OK, outer area of the water trouble hit only about 20 miles from my house.
      I am sure glad I don’t own Freedom Chemicals, I look for govt. to skin that bunch alive.
      I do know owners wife from many years ago. Not seen her in a very long time too.
      We had Turtle Man from KY with a TV show on Discovery Channel if I am not mistaken on TV network. But he & his whole crew came up at least 2 days straight in a row for free just trying to help out all they could and get more free drinking water & can goods to the people in need over this very sad happening.
      That’s all I best say, I am off topic little to much here, But I am & all my family is A OK.
      I am up in Morgantown WV area a lot on Business & WVU Football games. Company tried couple time’s to base myself directly up there 24/7 .

    • JessiMay 1:37 pm on January 21, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      Im glad to hear you and your family are good,Mark. I was wondering John,how did you hear about Paul and Maggie? Ihad never heard of them until I started following your blog.I think its so interesting and such a big deal when it comes to learning about Wonderland,yet there isnt alot of info about them and their part in the Wonderland saga.How did you come across this awrsome info? I would love to know more about them and their parts in all this.Thanx.cant wait to see your next post!!

  • John 1:36 pm on December 20, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , john holmes documentary,   

    Another British Documentary With Rare Footage 

    This is a different documentary that I have never seen before. It is not to be confused with the other British documentary that most of us have seen on YouTube. It is good resolution and very clear… and has great unseen footage and interviews. I was going to wait until Monday, but I have other stuff to post next week. The Wonderland stuff starts at about the 30 minute mark. Please post in the comments if you know anything about it.

    In this documentary, you get to see:

    • Video snippets of Eddie Nash walking around and being hounded by the press. That smirk is undeniable!
    • Alternate views of Eddie’s house- very good angles and views
    • Video of John being led out of court or jail in a parking lot in handcuffs
    • Prosecutor Ron Coen showing where Holmes bloody palm print was on the bed
    • More interviews with Det. Tom Blake
    • Interviews with who I think is Nash cohort and Holmes’ friend, Hal Glickman (who was a bail bondsman)
    • Pre-trial and trial footage from court
    • Talk of Holmes’ hunger strike while in jail on contempt charges. “He went on a hunger strike…and gained weight. He fasted between meals” –Ron Coen
    • Laurie Holmes talks about John’s mortal remains and how they were spread off the coast of Oxnard or Santa Catalina with his immediate family present
    • Warning! Nudity
    • Bobby 10:19 pm on December 20, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Just got through watching it – nice doco with lots of archival footage I’d never seen before. It was also great seeing Ron Coen showing the exact location of the hand print on Launius’s bed frame. No mention of David Lind though as they really wizzed through the Wonderland chapter. Regardless, a great find John!

    • Jill C. Nelson 5:11 pm on December 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      This is “XXXL: The John Holmes Story” released in the U.K in 2000. Lots of footage from “Exhausted” here. The documentary was/is not legally designated for release in the United States or Canada.

      “Holmes bloody palm print was on the bed.”
      Again, it’s important to note that the palm print was not bloody.

      • Ken D. 6:06 pm on December 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Yes Jill,you are correct….. Had the palm print been bloody Holmes most likely would not have beat the charges. During his trial his lawyers contended that with as much time as Holmes had spent in the house prior to the murders,it would not be unsusual at all for the palm print to be there and other places in the house. Had it been bloody,they would not have been able to argue this….

      • scabiesoftherat 1:05 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Two things struck me as being odd about this. Amerson says John went to his house covered in blood and Sharon says the same thing. I mean, which is it? Also, the palm print for the prosecution is/can be a carrot before the cart type deal when it comes to a jury. John was in that house so much, yet they decline to tell how many OTHER places his fingerprints/handprints were because to do so would knock the wind out of their sails, so to speak. That would be rather anti-climactic to a jury. Just a thought. (That, of course, is not to say that I think John was innocent. I just think holmes got damn lucky that the print WASN’T bloody….considering the amount of blood Amerson and Sharon said he had on him…if one or the other actually saw him that morning. They probably all went out to breakfast.)

        Just a thought.

        PS. That pinky ring on Tom Blake. LOL. What was the cameraman’s thought process about that one? LOL

        (“….must get shot of that ring before we leave,….the boys in editing won’t believe this….”)

        Sorry. I digress. That was the strangest camera shot of the whole documentary,….you know, except for when holmes stood up pulled his junk out in front of that woman. It was then that I thought, “Oh, shit,…this IS German TV.”

        Awesome documentary though. Wish I knew who the guy with the parrot on his head was. (Good Lord. Never, ever thought I would write a sentence like that.)

        • Ken D. 1:58 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          Bill Amerson is a well known bullshit artist so I would tend to think that it was him who was lying about a bloody John Holmes coming to his house that morning.

        • Jill C. Nelson 7:14 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          “Awesome documentary though. Wish I knew who the guy with the parrot on his head was.”

          That was Joel Sussman, a first rate photographer and one of Holmes’ closest friends.

        • criticextraordinaire 1:54 pm on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          I’d love to see Amerson do an interview for this blog. Heck, it would have to be a SERIES of interviews since he has so much material for sure. Joel Sussman would be another great interview and I’ll bet he would be willing. Something tells me that Amerson would want to be paid.

        • scabiesoftherat 11:44 pm on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          Thank you Ken and Jill for the answers to my questions. Much appreciated.
          PS. Good find, John. As usual.

          Holmes brother was pretty insightful in this doc.

    • criticextraordinaire 8:01 pm on December 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      First time I’ve seen this documentary. The things that struck me were:

      1. Amerson trying to swing that bat in the cage was a riot.

      2. Coen still can’t accept that he lost the case and that Holmes was found innocent.

      3. David Bowman comes off as a complete butt munch.

      4. “Here lady, let me show you my identification”

      5. There was the one scene where the porn distributor talked about Holmes saying that having sex with some random porn star “was real”. Lori then got a very odd look on her face, almost a look of betrayal like maybe John had told her that “it was real”. That was a sad scene.

    • Mark C 6:01 pm on December 25, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      In a strange way I think through so many years of all the very well published & known lies & bull stories told by John Holmes himself through out his whole life, This only adds greatly to more of the mystery of this story.

      Not only we got 1 huge unpunished unsolved multi person cold blooded murder case appears everybody even over seas are very interested in . Eddie was charged with Conspiracy to commit murder and not Capital Murder. I guess I might be wrong, But I feel its is still a open murder case on LA police record books, Thanks’ to John consent lying we have to work our way through all the huge collection of what really John told people and separate what was the real truth fact’s and what was a other one of his countless lies he was well known to tell.. Even without the multi-murder case on John’s record. I think John Holmes true life story could very well went down in history as he was one of the biggest and best liars this world ever known. Plus it would sell I think hugely at the box office.

      I am all for a movie about the real true life story of Ronnie Launius that hopefully will end in a shadow of a arm and pipe coming toward Ronnie head while he sound asleep..

      But come down to it. John Holmes true life story has never ever been put on film properly either . That Boogie Nights movie was just a movie that used only a small part of John life as a movie making idea and rest was made up. Wonderland a great movie in its own right but it only covered about a 1 year period in all these peoples life’s and not a long term life story of any of these people involved.
      This case could have at least 2 separate very good movies story’s here.. I think they should not be combine these peoples life story into 1 movie. Both Ronnie and John both deserve a movie based on each of there own true life story ..
      Even today I feel sure all the interest just in The John Holmes name you have a huge group of people waiting for his true life story movie to hit the big screen. We just have to face it John Holmes name collect interest in huge amount of the people not only in the USA, But world wide even today after 26 years after his death. It be very hard to even find a famous Hollywood Star that would draw all that much world wide attention after all these years.

      Well Eddie Nash has really got a very interesting true life story too.
      I feel sure they at least 2 maybe more very great true movie plots in these people who life’s came together very violently on a very hot summers night in 1981 in city of Angles .

      This give anybody any great ideas, Don’t forget about me now!! I sure could help out in some manner and sure could use just a few extra dollars throw my way if our dream would come true on these movies idea. Nope don’t know 1st thing about movie business but I am a fast learner.

      But this is just about a almost once in life time chance of finding 2 & maybe 3 people who true life stories would make such wonderful & great true life movies that are begging to be made.

      • criticextraordinaire 12:13 pm on December 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Mark, I too would like to see a movie about Ronnie, but I’d prefer that it end just as he and the guys are leaving Eddie’s place, basking in their moment of (short-lived) triumph. Kind of a Butch-and-Sundance feel to it.

        I can actually see the final shot. It is a freeze frame where you see Ronnie busting out the door at Dona Lola, looking like the cat that ate the canary; he’s slightly out of focus. Meanwhile, Eddie is in the background, sharp focus, with a look on his face that unmistakably portends the rest of the story. Roll the credits and the epilogue text.

        • mark c 8:24 pm on December 28, 2013 Permalink

          criticextraordinaire I think you completely correct that would be a so much better ending for a Ronnie movie. Anybody served in Vietnam I always have the upmost very high regard for them. Lot of them guys when through a non-sleep 1 whole year nightmare that stays with them even today. I personally seen couple times what happens during them guys having flashbacks, Not a pretty site to see at all without going into much detail.

          In Army supply Ronnie just might had to fill some tanks or bombs with agent orange or was standing right there supervising it to keep track of the gallons used.. You never really know the true process unless you was there.
          Armed services are famous for what is it they call it ? something like SASFU or something like that. not a too pretty name that explains there daily grind.
          But I feel the wonderland gang know who they was going to hit before hand. They just didn’t care or thought they could pull it off without major paybacks, I think I read they was moving elsewhere right after the heist anyway. I blame Holmes and his big line of BS for that mistake. Holmes wanted all the money & drugs but he sure made sure he would not be right there involved in the heist itself. He sat home with the girls . Mr. Lind just don’t want to get more any more dirty than he already was..
          I feel sure Holmes made a key to that security gate for Wonderland House too.. More than likely within the first 5 minutes he first had a key to the gate, before they took it back away from him, I guess for smoking all that dope he smoked and he didn’t pay for. Plus all of Ronnie’s “Scum Bag Tax” . added up too.
          I like that part about one of Holmes porn pal’s talking about Holmes telling people all the degrees he got from UCLA. The Closest Holmes ever got to UCLA was stealing stereos out of cars in the parking lot.
          Nothing on TV tonight, I am going to watch Wonderland again!!

        • criticextraordinaire 8:25 am on December 29, 2013 Permalink

          Well Mark, Johnny could not have gone on the actual Nash invasion. Eddie and Greg knew John so he would have been dead meat had he been there. (Although it ended up that way anyway, due to John wearing the jewelry the next day) The only way John could have participated in the actual invasion would be if they had agreed to kill Eddie.

          Eddie didn’t know Ronnie, David, or Billy, which was odd given their alpha-dog status in the dope business at the time. John did go to Eddie’s THREE TIMES to make sure the sliding door was left unlocked for the guys though, so he certainly was an active participant in the heist, albeit in a clandestine role.

          I can’t help but think that if they were doing the heist today, Tracy would have been driving a stolen SUV instead of that clapped-out Granada, and there would have been plenty of room for John to have waited with him in the car.

          Whenever John smoked up that shipment he was supposed to deliver for the gang, I’ll bet Ronnie was absolutely furious. Due to Ronnie’s extensive experience in the Air Force logistics command, he knew this was going to throw off the production and inventory numbers, and he already had enough headaches managing his supply chain. Big mistake for Johnny.

    • localarts 1:01 pm on December 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I can see this. Of course you would have to include the Lind & Deverell.

      • criticextraordinaire 4:48 pm on December 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Oh absolutely. That was likely a big part of the dynamic. Ronnie and David each doing the Nash hit trying to prove just how bad ass each were. And Billy pretty much had to go along on the job after all that big talk he and Tracy said about “going it alone” on the job.

        David might be a good subject for a flick too, what with his various brushes with famous people and situations. There’s still a small part of me that thinks he went into the WPP though.

        • John 10:50 am on December 28, 2013 Permalink

          In the movie about Ronnie flick, you could have his character played by Ryan Gosling, that way women and teenage girls would go see it. Ron could break the fourth wall by winking at the camera at the end of key scenes, like a classic or bad Burt Reynolds comedy.

        • criticextraordinaire 11:18 am on December 28, 2013 Permalink

          Well that approach could work, John… if the movie is done like “Goodfellas” and is told from Ronnie’s perspective. Occasionally the scene can stop and Ronnie offers his insight. “We got it all… the dope, the money, the guns. We had Johnny Wadd literally hanging out at our place. Even the vaunted Eddie Nash was on his knees to us. We ruled the world…”

          I’d like to see Suge Knight play the role of Greg Diles. Cast Owen Wilson in the role of Holmes. I’ve got to think about the rest of the cast. For Ronnie I always wanted to go with Joe Elmore, the guy on Horsepower TV.

        • switzerland avenue 3:21 am on December 31, 2013 Permalink

          I would love to see a wonderland movie done in the way of “gone baby gone”. No famous actors, but capable of expressing the real side of drug consuming and trafficking. For the bigger budget version: Daniel Day-Lewis as Nash and send Paul Giamatti to that damn mask and let him do holmes’ last years…

    • localarts 6:25 pm on December 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Unfortunately, there’s not a lot of information about Lind. He may very well have been in the WPP. I know he went into hiding immediately after spilling his guts to Lange and Souza, Lind was picked up a month later by the LAPD.

      I can definitely see the Butch Cassidy & the Sundance Kid angle, especially at the end. I would much rather see Ronnie go out in a hail of gun fire with the LAPD like Newman & Redford did at the end of the movie as opposed to having his brains beaten out of his skull while he was asleep. As Ronne & David burst out of the front door of Nash’s with Deverell not far behind, jefe de la policía (Daryl Gates) and the rest of the LAPD open fire and the rest is history!

    • russell White 12:19 am on December 29, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Great new info John. Not sure how you are doing it, but I am blown away! I have been online for 10 years and never heard one bit about the dogs. Also, did you find out if Susan is still alive. When I talked to Nils last year, he did not know but doubted, based on her health.

    • localarts 1:29 pm on December 31, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I can only imagine what the New Years Eve parties were like at Wonderland! It would probably take at least a week to recover.

    • Jude Falu 1:58 am on October 25, 2016 Permalink | Reply

      Wow! Thank you! I permanently wanted to write on my site something like that. Can I include a fragment of your post to my site?

  • John 12:08 pm on December 20, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: ronnie launius, ,   

    The Widow Of Ronnie’s Friend Speaks 

    Just a little info today. Carroll was the man, along with Paul Ballard, who Ronnie was busted smuggling drugs with in 1973. Carroll Sherrill died in prison in 1982 under suspicious circumstances.

    Here is what his widow had to say:

    I am not sure when Carroll and Ronnie met, like I said he and I were not a couple until eight years after we met though we had been friends between 1970 and 1978. Long story again, sorry.

    From what I can remember about Ronnie he seemed to have an air of self confidence and coolness about him. I remember he was very good-looking and as far as he and Susan really being in love I don’t know. They seemed happy and comfortable with each other, but I think they compromised their relationship for other things at times.

    I was never into drugs so as far as the whole drug scene with any of them I was never around.  Junior kept me protected from all that for so many years and then when Carroll and I got together he protected me and my son by staying  away as when he got into the whole hard core drug scene.

    • Jessi May 9:28 am on December 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I love your blog! I’ve been checking everyday for new info.I thought I was the only person who couldnt get enough of everything wonderland,but it’s nice to know there are others like me!!!

      • John 5:38 pm on December 23, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Jessi, stop by and drop a note or leave a question in the comments any time! No one will flame you here or be rude. Glad to have ya on board!

        • scabiesoftherat 1:25 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          Jessi May, John is right. No one will ever utter a foul word here towards you. This is a safe place. One of the only places on the web where everyone is on board. We are all trying to figure this out together. That was one totally screwed up night in ’81, wasn’t it? Get on board and start talking about it, Jessi May! You are as welcome as anyone here. You’re family. If they accept me, they accept you!….(you still do accept me, right, john?)


        • John 8:03 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          Fukken A!

    • susan 6:07 pm on December 26, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Hi I am new to this site. I signed up a couple of weeks ago. I come here all the time to get more info on this case. When I saw the movie I had to find out as much as I could. Pleas John keep it coming. I think there are many of us who want to know more. Sue

      • John 11:01 am on December 28, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Thanks Susan. We’re glad you stopped by. Be sure to use the search box for just about any Wonderland person or topic. It’s here someplace. Or, post a question and someone will help answer it. Happy New Year!

        • scabiesoftherat 11:48 pm on January 6, 2014 Permalink

          They always do with me! I had the movie being made in 1993 when it was actually made in 2003. I was politely corrected,…and gained some insight as to how polite people were on this board. Everyone is here to learn, Susan. This is really the best place to do it. John has many great pearls on here. I honestly think this is the most interactive Wonderland site in existence. Really.

          (Of course, at the rate the information keeps coming on this board, you really don’t want to spend any time anywhere else. John is a great researcher,…and no, John. That’s not blatant ass-kissing,…but he is! Where else could you find a Julia Negron interview a few steps away from a Liberace video? This site is boss, man!))

          BTW,….your last name wouldn’t happen to be Launius, would it? If it is, please email John. I think he would like to talk to you….

          P.S. John! For the sheer hell of it, you should write a piece on Hunter S. Thompson. Just one piece. Why?….Because this blog gives him a run for his money. Even though he’s dead, let him know you’re here!!

          Ok. II’ll shut up now….

    • Alex 11:06 pm on January 3, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      The widow of Ronnie’s friend seems to have hit the nail on the head. Her description of Ron is well put. She stated, “he seemed to have an air of self confidence and coolness about him. I remember he was very good-looking and as far as he and Susan really being in love I don’t know. They seemed happy and comfortable with each other, but I think they compromised their relationship for other things at times.” This is how I remember him as well and as for his “wife” I agree. Everyone seems to think they had this loving relationship. Absolutely no one has mentioned the girlfriend he had at the time of his death. It is as if she did not even exist. Wow, I think that is something that really surprises me. I was told they (Susan and Ron I knew his as Ron) were not getting along at the time of his death and that many people thought she let the murders in because it was her way of getting back at him partly because he was involved with a new female. I guess I just wonder how come the girlfriend was never brought up.

      • John 9:35 am on January 6, 2014 Permalink | Reply

        Susan was found naked by the medics, Alex. Thus, I think she and Ron had a romantic evening that night. Why else would he ask her to come visit. I’m not sure she would risk being killed just to get back at Ron for something.

    • localarts 12:33 pm on January 6, 2014 Permalink | Reply

      “She let the murders in because it was her way of getting back at him partly because he was involved with a new female” This would imply Susan had prior knowledge of the plot to murder the residence of 8763. Not plausible at all.

  • John 3:24 pm on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: ,   

    David Lind’s Cousin Fills In Some Gaps 

    I reached out to his cousin, whom I found online. This is what she sent me. I won’t post the photo of Dave’s mom, but she is a nice looking woman. Dave was married, but I have only found public record of a divorce, which was in the late 60s or early 70s.

    Read on… (Thanks Dev!)

    My family has tried to stay away from the whole incident. I know that David’s mother, who was my grandfather’s sister, was very embarrassed by the whole thing. I, of course, am more removed, so when my mother told me about it, I was quite fascinated, and was living in LA, so of course I went to visit the house.

    I also met Dawn a few years ago, and told her I was related to David. She was very sweet.  She signed her book for me, which I still need to get around to reading…..did you read it?

    My mom has told me that he was not very involved with the family, but when he was around he was a really fun person, very much a ladies’ man, and there was always a feeling of danger when he was around.  He always had his motorcycle with him.  I don’t know if he was actually a part of a Hell’s Angels chapter or not, but I am sure he knew them.  He did have a wife and two children, I believe.  I think he was divorced, I never met any of them, I think they live in Northern California.

    I am attaching a picture of his mother, she is the most beautiful woman.  David had a younger brother who also has distanced himself from our family, he is in the Pacific Northwest, I think, with his family.  David’s real father left when he was fairly young, and his mother found another man who was a soldier in WW2, and was very stable and loving. So any darkness that David inherited I would say came from his father, whoever he was.  I think we only have one photo of him.

    • dreamweaverjenn 11:01 pm on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I am fascinated by this. Have always wanted to know more about David Lind. Thank you so much for sharing.

    • criticextraordinaire 5:48 am on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      John scores another exclusive. Oddly the part I find most fascinating is that this gal got Dawn to sign her book but has not gotten around to reading it.

      Would be nice to hear what David’s kids would have to say about his years both before and after 1981, as we don’t seem to know much about him. Maybe they would have David’s appearance with Morton Downey Jr. on a VCR tape.

    • localarts 9:21 am on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      A DVD version of Dave’s appearance on that show would make a great Christmas gift!!

      • John 9:41 am on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        From what has been said about that episode… Dave was about to permanently relocate that cigarette into Mort’s right nostril.

    • localarts 10:41 am on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I’m sure Mort knew better than to blow cigarette smoke in Dave’s face as he had so many of his other guest. Would really to see this episode.

  • John 8:50 am on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: julia densmore negron   

    Rock Star Wife Talks About Wonderland 

    Those on the secret email list for the blog have read this, but I thought I would post it today and also tell you that I am chasing several things, including a man who used to party with Nash and Diles at the house, and a guy who knew Ron at the time of his death. Stay tuned!

    From Julia Densmore-Negron… I can’t post too much from her, she has a book coming out. Comments in parenthesis are mine.

    I hate to post stuff all over the internet because I do want to include in book, however your site seems comprehensive, not just sensational stuff. Sick of reading about Holmes, other then his sleaze pretty much caused this tragedy. The natural course of things, since the house was watched, would have been arrest and more prison time for all those guys. I found the (Holmes) preliminary transcript interesting, though I wasn’t part of that hearing. My testimony in the main trial was more to set the stage.. and discuss “B”, who was with me – and was held briefly and released (the afternoon of the murders, they went to the house. She went to call police and “B” was found inside by the cops, briefly held in a squad car and released).

    I know nothing about those other people, they were just low lifes that Billy introduced into the scene. Frankly I never paid any attention to them. When buzzed in we always went straight up to Joys bedroom. And if you knew Joy – you would find it shocking she even took up with Billy. I remember her place in SM (Santa Monica), a nice home and this started that way too. Those scenes in the movie with big loud parties.. I never saw anything like that, very private because of the dealing going on.

    I believe a lot of what you post is accurate. Tom Lange talked to us often about why Nash got so mad (The humiliation part.) If anything I am glad I did not hesitate to call police as that girl Susan was still alive. I did not see her when I went in, but then it was a blur of hideous-ness.. The trial was scary, we feared retribution of some kind although we did not know much, just what I told you. But it was clear what happened and why.

    I was always grateful I went home that night and did not return when Joy called later.

    Det Lange (She remembers him most) talked to Chuck (her husband Chuck Negron) about what he thought might be info/evidence.. it had something to do with Joy or Billy giving Holmes a key? I think Chuck remembered something about it or them asking for it back or something. But you really had to jump through hoops most of the time to get in, call first, then go buzz, wait to get buzzed in.

    That day we found them.. remember Joy had called in the night saying come down, I’ll *give* you something. (this was not usually the case) That word kept ringing in my head and I called often, no answer. When “B” came over we decided to risk wrath and go on down to the house. The metal gate was open, the dogs were loose, that’s why we walked in. I remember the flies.. they must have been dead 12 hours. I did not go upstairs, “B” did. I don’t know that he liked being linked, so don’t publish his last name. After I called the cops he did like an ass go back down there. I called Chuck who was at a meeting with Three Dog and he was furious with me for going in – the killer could have still been in the house as far as we knew…

    SO “B” goes back down there and they put him in cuffs, they released him but the defense brought him up a lot at trial. He was a pussycat. It was crazy.

    • Brandy 9:37 am on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Wow, this most certainly fed my sick fascination with this case. Thanks! I cannot wait for her book.

      • John 9:51 am on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Heheh! Not sick… just curious 😉

    • Beth 10:20 am on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I guess I’m confused…she’s saying she and her husband discovered the bodies? I thought it was a mover or something? First time I’ve ever heard of this person, I must have missed something! And not to sound mean or anything, but it kind of bugs me when people talk about the other victims as “low life scum” like they deserved to die or something. They were still people, and, afterall, apparently this chick was going there for drugs too, so does that not make her also a “low life scum”? Cast the first stone, just sayin…only low life scum I see in this story even aside from Holmes is Nash!

      • John 10:28 am on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Hi Beth. It’s been discussed and posted about here before but with over 500 posts and thousands of comments, it’s impossible to catch it all or read it all. Julia and her friend “B” found the bodies, her husband was in a meeting. Of course, others had been in the house also, but she and her guy friend mentioned it to the movers. People like Paul Kelly may have been in the house but they did not report the crime, they just left. The reason so many people came over that day is because the day before Ronnie was calling everyone to try and move all the newly acquired dope. Early news reports did not know the extent of this and just mentioned “movers found the bodies”. Of course, she is not the first person to refer to the housemates in a negative way.

        • Beth 4:46 pm on December 18, 2013 Permalink

          Ahhh, okay thanks for clearing that up for me, I did go back and read a lot of the posts but I probably missed it! I know others have talked about the housemates in that way too, guess it’s a sore spot for me because I have a brother who could very well be in the same spot someday and even though he’s a loser and a jerk if anything happens to him it will be devastating. I think that’s why I like to hear as much as possible about all the housemates, their lives prior to this, it’s easy to forget they were real people with real histories. Thanks so much for your awesome work on this subject!

    • Mark C 10:54 am on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Great update,
      Question of the key I say I will never know the truth. But if I was a betting man, Holmes had him a key copied within first 2 hours he first got a key to the gate if this is the case. I guess I am just interested if Holmes let Nash guys in without even buzzing for door to be opened.. Billy had his pants on but very well could of heard somebody outside open the metal gate without first buzzing then it sound like team of horse’s coming up the steps.

      • John 2:58 pm on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        I would think he copied the key also. Just imagine Holmes thinking “Hey donkey dick, we are all going to the Jackson Browne concert at the Hollywood Bowl tomorrow so don’t stop
        by the house, we won’t be home” I made a copy of the key, woo hoo!

    • dreamweaverjenn 10:52 pm on December 18, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Wow……..you must have been petrified and shocked to say the very least!

    • criticextraordinaire 5:37 pm on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Julia might not like Johnny Wadd but you got to admit, thanks to him people like Ronnie, David, Joy, Billy, and even Tracy eeked out a little slice of immortality. Without his involvement they were headed to a similar end anyway. John just made it more interesting.

      And finally he did not hold a gun to those peoples heads. They were doing armed ripoffs long before Johnny C. came on the scene.

    • Mark C 10:58 pm on December 19, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I was just thinking I caught myself doing that once before few weeks ago.. I don’t think I am every going to go on a other web site & share with them what mainly new information that you yourself found out for us on this web site, With your great Detective work.
      You really are doing a very good job on this Detective Work & lots long hour’s of work that you yourself put into getting us all this new information for us to read..
      That just was not the right thing to of had done on my part at all. So Sorry..
      You never said 1 word to myself at all over this type of conduct from myself. I saw it later & said to myself that was A very wrong thing of myself to had did that.
      But look on good side. I did learned from my mistake pretty quick over this problem..
      Let them on the other web site’s find out about new infro. for themselves.. Plus this site 200% better than any other web site that I found.
      Sorry little off subject but wanted everybody know I feel & I did do something I personally feel it was very wrong thing to have done on my part & I do feel sorry about it.
      Problem is sometimes, Its medication that Dr. give me over at least 9 cracked or bulging spinal cord disc’s and bunch broken ribs & huge number of other beats & bangs all over on my body I got.
      After 33+ years as A Diesel Mechanic/ Welder. Hopefully some of you will understand working with that stuff daily that is way heavier than yourself your body will get beat-up pretty bad after 30 years on job 6 to 7 days a week. 12 hours daily. That is why DR. prescribe that medication to myself for.
      I guess I am Guilty of TUI ( Typing Under The Influence ) Not a excuse, Only a mistake on my part that I try not to let it happen again

      • John 8:56 am on December 20, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        No worries. Anyone can come here and borrow what info they want. I’m not at all possessive over things that I have found or posted. It’s fair game. Maybe someone will write a book or something, since I don’t have the time to do it. I have a day job too…and a-hem…a life LOL. Writing a book is hard work and then there’s the leg work and travel.

    • jimmy---chicago 7:36 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I hope her book is better than chucks read his when it first came out you can tell he has been through mega rehab I hope it’s not gona be one of those hard luck rehab stories with how to tell your loved one is a junkie type chapters in it

      • John 8:07 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        I read a lot of rock n roll books and biographies too, Jimmy. I hate the early years that they always cover. I want to read about sex, drugs and rock n roll and the early chapters are like “I was born the son of a sharecropper” type shit. LOL

        • jimmy---chicago 1:55 pm on December 24, 2013 Permalink

          Yeah im really not into storys that sound like an AA meating or narcotics annonomus

      • criticextraordinaire 7:04 pm on December 24, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        You gotta admit though… the part of Chuck’s book where he talks about his dick exploding is pretty darned funny. :-O

        • jimmy---chicago 8:25 am on December 25, 2013 Permalink

          yeah how about the picture in the book with his wife sitting next to him in the airport with that bandage holding his nose togeather she has this priceless expression on her face like( Im so through with this guy). She looked soooo embarassed

        • John 11:15 am on December 28, 2013 Permalink

          His dick exploded? What the hell. I was talking to a doctor at a party once. He told me men never call back when he asks them to let him know how their ankle or elbow is doing etc. Men will only call back when it is penis related healing LOL (doc, it looks a little less red today) hahaaa thay is so true about men

        • criticextraordinaire 11:30 am on December 28, 2013 Permalink

          Yeah, he was so hopped up on dope that he was having sex pretty much 24/7. Weird as this may sound you actually CAN have too much sex and he wore the thing raw. Finally whilst in the middle of a session with Miss Oklahoma, His “penis virtually exploded” and he was not being rhetorical.

          Here’s a quote from http://beyondthepale-greta.blogspot.com/2012/07/weird-er-side-of-rock-and-roll.html :

          ” But of all the problems which beset the band during their halcyon days, they are most famous for what happened to lead singer Chuck Negron’s penis. Negron was apparently so prolific when it came to bedding groupies that his second most important organ became swollen and chafed, necessitating a visit to the doctor. After examining Negron’s penis, the doctor told him that he would have to lay off sex for a while or there could be dire consequences. Unfortunately, being the rock and roll animal that he was, Negron refused to listen to the doctor’s warning and continued his lothario ways, until, finally, whilst in the throes of lovemaking with an unnamed Miss America contestant, Negron heard a sudden “whooshing” sound as his overused joystick split down the middle (“like a hot dog”, accordng to Negron). That was bad enough, but during the subsequent visit to the emergency room, Negron had to endure the titters and giggles of the hospital staff as they stitched up the maligned member. Now clean and sober for 17 years, having lost every penny he made with Three Dog Night to a drug habit even bigger than his sexual appetite, Negron says that he looks back on the experience with “some amusement.””

    • jimmy---chicago 7:51 am on December 24, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Chuck was not prince charming feel sorry for his band mates and loved ones but chuck and her were dependant on loosers for D O P E so what does that make her both of her husbands were RICH ROCK STARS and her and chuck were hanging out there Im sure there were more upscale dealers for them but oops did they burn them and had to go slumming for dealers in LA

    • jim 8:51 am on December 29, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      rockstar wife said in an earlier post how she and chuck gave furniture to joy( the same joy who was tyring to come on to chuck) and not ask for it back.Well in chucks book he said joy was attracted to him and would carry him ( bank roll him with free dope) so he said he would give joy antique furniture from time to time for that but she would carry him most of the time .Chuck says in his book that he and rock star wife had a 2000 dollar a day habit .They were up to their necks in debt to joy and had to give up there furniture to cover their debts also she claims that joy set them up once in chucks book he says joy got so into debt with a dealer called fat herbie or something else because chuck could not pay this guy back for his habit he smacked joy around to get chucks name and chuck went after him with a shotgun its all in his book .A lot of people colud get the wrong idea from what Julia tries to spin to look good

    • Pixie 10:37 pm on June 26, 2016 Permalink | Reply

      The dogs have been bugging me for the last few days (I’ve been thinking about this case a lot lately due to the anniversary coming up). I had been wondering about whether or not they were harmed during the murders. It sounds like they weren’t. I’ve read in a few accounts that there were dogs (I’ve never been able to find out how many) who were outside behind the gates serving as guard dogs. How many were there, and what happened to them? I think I’ve read on here in someone’s account (can’t remember whom) that they were pit bulls. Do you know more about the dogs? I hope they weren’t hurt. At the same time, they must not have been very good guard dogs if they were hanging around while the murders happened and didn’t harm the intruders. Regardless of their knowing Holmes, if they heard screaming and chaos, then they would have been going crazy and would have attacked the intruders the minute they came back out if they were truly attack dogs. After reading this, with the owners dead inside and people coming and going later that morning, those dogs must not have been true guard dogs-otherwise, nobody would have gotten in.

      I watched the crime scene video again for the first time in years. I remember seeing it the first time and thinking that the detectives who were commenting sure couldn’t seem to hide their contempt for the home’s occupants (I remembered a snarky comment from a detective about dirty dishes in the sink). Watching it again this week, I didn’t get that perception. I also didn’t get the perception that this was a wild party house. As Julia says, the house was rather nice inside, minus the ransacking by the intruders. It was typical of an upper class/middle class house in terms of being fully furnished with furniture that was pleasant, not too outlandish, matching, and in decent shape. Nothing crazy like avant-garde furniture or furniture that had been falling apart or destroyed by too many parties. Certainly didn’t look like the hideout of a gang; nor did it look like a hardcore drug den. It looked like an ordinary house in that part of LA during the early 80s.

      But, I’d love to know more about the dogs. John, did you ever find out about the dogs? What happened to them?

      • John 10:37 am on June 27, 2016 Permalink | Reply

        The dogs were pit bulls named Dylan and Carla. Both owned by Billy DeVerrell. Carla was raised by him, so she was a sweet dog, but Dylan he acquired later and that dog was a bit messed up I guess. Since people came and went all the time, the dogs were used to it. They were not really good guard dogs, and were more pets I guess. Allowed to roam the concrete they didn’t have a true backyard to pee and poop in, so I guess Billy walked them daily, who knows. But Kevin, Bill’s son, says after the murders, with the gate left open, the dogs were roaming the street. Kevin called some shelters and finally got a hit on Carla and picked her up. Dylan was nowhere to be found. But after Kevin went back to his Navy post, his sister took Carla to the beach and not used to so much open space, she ran off at at the beach and sis could not find her. That was the last they saw of Carla. This is all in the book.

    • Pixie 12:05 pm on June 27, 2016 Permalink | Reply

      Poor pups. What a sad life they had. I can’t imagine what they may have witnessed. Hopefully Dylan was picked up by a patient neighbor who loved dogs. Coyotes are a big problem in that area, but at least the two dogs were too big to be coyote food.

      I’m curious about Joy’s house in Santa Monica. I wonder if Billy lived with her at that house. I’ve been trying to track down Chuck’s book, but it’s not in any of my local libraries, and Amazon has it for an extortionate price. I think I’ll look into Julia’s book.

      The more I discover about life at 8763, the more I learn that despite her criminal activities and shady friends, Joy was still living a fairly normal life for someone who was a drug addict. I’m curious to know if Billy and Joy’s kids ever came to visit 8763.

      • John 12:14 pm on June 27, 2016 Permalink | Reply

        Yes, the kids came to visit, ya know as often as grown kids will do. They just thought it a normal, well kept house. Why it was so shocking after the murders. They didn’t really know the extent of it all. At a birthday party for one of Joy’s daughters, Paul Kelly took a shit on her birthday cake. I can’t remember the particulars but Kevin D. told me that story. Paul was a real d-bag.

        • pixie 12:22 pm on June 27, 2016 Permalink

          Oh hell no. Somethings are unforgivable, and that would be one of them. Do you know what Joy and her daughter did when that happened?

          I’m glad to see I’m not the only one who looked at the images from that house and thought that minus the blood, bodies, the gun displayed on the wall in Ron’s room (I don’t have a problem with the gun per se; I just think it was displayed in a really weird way), and the ransacking, the house appeared fairly normal and unremarkable. I can understand why the kids would be surprised.

    • pixie 12:14 pm on June 27, 2016 Permalink | Reply

      Bummer…it looks like Julia’s book hasn’t come out. 😦 Hopefully it will.

    • jimmy---chicago 10:52 am on July 1, 2016 Permalink | Reply

      Chucks book seems more fare on what was going on at wonderland compaired to julias interview .She dosent act like they were friends where chuck admits he was friends with them and has true remorse he even used to give joy and billy antique furniture for dope and also conserning the way their house looked just because they were junkies does not mean they lived like slobs .But getting back to julia she is a real trip

      • Woooodstock 6:22 pm on August 12, 2016 Permalink | Reply

        A bit of a tangent but given the insular nature of the Laural Canyon music scene and dopers in general, I’m curious if there is any possibility that Lowell George of Little Feat was involved with the Wonderland crowd? Danny Hutton knew Lowell and did some vocals for Little Feat and Lowell was fond of heroin, wrote a song about it. China White. Any thoughts or info on this?

    • Woooodstock 10:18 am on August 15, 2016 Permalink | Reply

      Tried posting the other day and it didn’t work so I’m gonna try again. I’m curious as to whether anyone has ever heard of Lowell George of Little Feat having any connection to the Wonderland gang. He and Danny Hutton from Three Dog Night were friends, Danny recorded vocals on some Little Feat songs and Lowell was very much into heroin. Hell he wrote a song called China White so it would seem natural for him to be involved with those guys, but I’ve never heard that he was. Any thoughts or info?

    • Woooodstock 11:39 am on August 15, 2016 Permalink | Reply

      Ok, thats strange, both posts show up at the same time but the first one 3 days after I posted it. Oh well.

    • jimmy 11:26 am on August 16, 2016 Permalink | Reply

      With Chucks dependency problems and all the shit that Cory and Danny had dealt with him im sure they didn’t want to get their friends involved . They couldnt deal with him from what I remember in Chucks book he even eludes to the fact they couldnt deal with or tolerate him or his ideas

  • John 8:01 am on November 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: howie gordon,   

    Drama Teacher Who Knew Holmes Pens Book 

    This article is rather outstanding. Thanks to steel for the sweet link!

    My Drama Teacher, The Porn Star

    The director of my grade school plays, worked with the likes of John Holmes. We reunite to talk about his new memoir.

    by Tracy Clark Flory | Salon.com | November 16, 2013


    Bromance. John and Howie Gordon (Richard Pacheco).

    Howie Gordon directed my grade school plays. As a third grader, I vaguely understood that he was qualified for this gig because he had acting experience. I had no idea that much of it was in pornography.

    It was only a year ago that I figured it out. I was watching “After Porn Ends,” a documentary about what happens when adult performers return to “civilian” life, when I recognized Howie, the father of my classmate, the guy who enthusiastically taught us how to perform on stage and edited videos of our adolescent attempts at acting. It turned out Howie had an X-rated alter ego in the ’70s and ’80s: Richard Pacheco. My drama teacher, the porn star. Not only that but he’s a prolific, award-winning performer and Playgirl Man of the Year who worked with legends like John Holmes and Marilyn Chambers. He was even inducted into the Adult Video News Hall of Fame.

    As of very recently, he’s also the author of a memoir about his days in porn, “Hindsight: True Love & Mischief in the Golden Age of Porn.” It’s a tale of an overweight boy from Pittsburgh who sheds 50 pounds, starts lifting weights and finds himself doing adult movies. Before long, he’s posing for Playgirl and performing with porn’s greats. The book is appropriately filled with salacious details about his flings, on-screen and off, but it’s also a thoughtful and philosophical read. For him, doing porn was political: “I foolishly expected the heirs to the Sixties sexual revolution to be there en masse,” he writes. “They weren’t. And it remained sadly unconscionable that the sexual media for the entire culture of that time was largely relegated to an underclass of amateurs and criminals who mostly created a pornographic world of sexual looting and moral midgetry.”

    He expected more of the medium. It’s no surprise then that he is both a defender of the industry and a critic. “Sometimes the domination of male rage in the industry just gets to me,” he writes. “It comes off as so nasty and mean-spirited that it’s like sex without humanity.” He goes on to explain, “There is more to sex than conquest and vengeance. I want to see that portrayed, too.” Still, he loved his work and stayed in the industry, all the while battling over the idea of monogamy with his none-too-thrilled wife, until the threat of AIDS drove him out of the business.

    I spoke to him by phone about the difficulty of getting erections on-demand, what he thinks of porn today and how he told his kids about his past.

    Let’s start with how you got into porn.

    I was a senior in college and I had a girlfriend who was quite a stunner and one of the freshmen there wanted to make a sex film and invited the two of us to be the stars. I had grown up as the fat kid in life. I was relatively obese from the age of 7 to 17. I had the largest breasts in the seventh grade. I lost 50 pounds in the spring junior year of high school. I went from Quasimodo to Robert Redford and women who had never looked at me were now looking at me. When I was invited to be in a movie because of my looks, well, that was like winning the World Series and taking the ticker tape parade down Broadway. The fact that it was sex was just a bonus.

    I never dreamed it would become a professional career. Cut to five years later, we get a phone call. My wife Carly and I were on casting lists from some acting classes we had taken and they were looking for some women and they asked for her. They said it was a “romp through a hospital” and she asked quite directly, “Is that a porn film?” And normally they didn’t tell you over the phone because they had much more success getting people to be in the movies if they came down for an audition. The guy said, “Yes, it is.” And she said, “Well, I’m not interested, but maybe my husband will be” and handed me the phone.

    was interested — from a personal sense, my fantasy was to meet an X-rated woman. I thought such a person existed. I wanted a “fuck me, fuck me” woman; I’d never been with a prostitute, I’d never been with a bad girl. All my relationships with sex had been about love. I wanted lust and I hadn’t ever been able to make the object of my love the object of my lust. Those were the kind of women I wanted to meet and I thought I’d meet them in the X-rated movies and then come home wiser to my wife. In those days we had a relationship we used to call “yours, mine and ours.” We had free love. We were trying to do Romeo and Juliet and free love at the same time. As I said in the book, we beat that horse for 30 years until it died.

    You talk very candidly about performance issues on-set — this was before Viagra. What was it like having to rely for work on a body part that is, as a general rule, bad at performing under pressure?

    It was extraordinarily humiliating. You didn’t find guys like me in porn generally — and every actor is gonna say that because that’s the first thing that all of us say when we’re fighting the monster of sexual guilt when dealing with the mainstream — but how I was different was, well, for one, I had an average-size penis, or slightly below average I’d even say. Most of the guys in that business are hung like horses. So it was humiliating even to get naked in that crowd. What I brought to the table beyond the size of my erection was two things. One, my body was superb. I was living in the gym at that time. I weighed 143-and-a-half pounds. I had the body fat of a red ant. I had abs like a Greek god. So I was good to look at, and my penis was in proportion to my body. Beyond that, I could act. I just happened to come along at a time when they were trying to improve the quality of the acting. There was the notion that we could develop a market to trump Hollywood by making real movies that had real sex in them, as opposed to sex movies.

    So what happened on that first shoot?

    You can do the push-ups, you can do the sit-ups, you can make your body gorgeous, but you can’t promise that at 10 o’clock on Thursday morning you’re gonna get a hard-on. I get to the set and they’d scheduled a half day. All they gotta do is one scene: me getting a blow job in a closet. Foreplay consists of the director saying to the girl, “You get on your knees” and to me, “You pull down your pants, let’s go.” I’m hard, it feels good. They run out of film, she stops sucking me, and I lose the erection. It’s time to start again, it’s back to step one, and everything works again. To make a long story short, this happens maybe six, seven, eight times. Finally my penis said to me, “Hey, what’s going on here? Are we doing this or are we not doing this?” Then the director says to me, “OK, we have all the footage we need of the blow job. Now come.” At that point the woman starts sucking me like she’s trying to make me come and I don’t know how to slow her down because she just wants to get home.

    She’s sucking, nothing is happening. It’s 1:30. It’s 2 o’clock. They’re waiting me out. It’s 3 o’clock. The girl has her head on my thigh and she’s asleep. I’m so far beyond any humiliation I’ve ever felt. And all of a sudden I start thinking about the first girl I ever made out with. It’s the eighth grade, summer. I start to get aroused. The director sees it and he starts waking everybody up. She reached over and touched me and as soon as she touched me it went away. Her touch scared me at this point. The director said, “Don’t touch him. You masturbate till you come. And when that first squirt comes out, grab it like you did it.” And lo and behold that came to pass.

    What’s the worst porn line that you ever delivered?

    [Takes on exaggerated hillbilly accent] It’s from a movie called “Pizza Girls,” and some pretty girl would come over on roller skates with your pizza and then she’d come in your house and you’d have a sexual act together. When she knocked at the door, I had to say this line: “I’ve got a stove pipe in my pants just a’ waitin’ for you.”

    Let’s pivot to John Holmes. You say at one point in the book, “I would suspect that in reality his great cock was at once a gift and a nightmare for the man who had to live with it.” Why a nightmare?

    Well, because there were women who he tried to enter who no doubt just couldn’t handle it. Some women would see that cock and swoon in religious ecstasy. On the other side, there were women who would just start screaming. On the set, either reaction would be whatever it was, to be used in the context of the movie, but in your private life, what if the woman screaming is the woman you love?

    The electricity of seeing him in action was because we all lived with the superstition, the folk wisdom, that bigger was better. This is the moment that she found out. There would be no more mystery because it wasn’t going to get any bigger. His was like 14 fucking inches. I saw that thing in action and it was real, it’s not fake. It was like a donkey’s. It never really got hard like an average dick got hard, it got hardish, because if all the blood would go to his dick he’d pass out. There’s not enough blood in your body to run that thing. But it was quite something to watch.

    You write about the suicide of Shauna Grant, real name Colleen Marie Applegate, that it was “not the first suicide in the porn community,” that there was “almost one a year.” Why was that, do you think?

    Well, these are misleading conversations if you only focus on that and talk about that without context. The occupation with the highest suicide rate in the U.S. is dentistry. [Ed. note: It might actually be physicians.] But it’s a lot less scandalous when a dentist kills himself than someone in the porn world.

    That having been said, pornography as it was constituted then and as it exists now attracts the desperate, who need to opt out for their own personal reasons. You have a lot of desperate people in porn and where desperate people exist, suicide exists. A lot of people [in the industry] say, “I want to be a movie star. I’m going to have pretty clothes, people are going to worship me.” Instead people look at you with contempt, like you’re scum.

    You said of porn, “It was the rage that used to get to me, the meanness and the rage.” What do you think about porn these days?

    I’m less informed. Mostly what I see are the commentaries about it more than I watch it. I’ll watch the old stuff to death. I’m told that our era is referred to as the “golden age of porn.” Today’s stuff is cheaper, it’s down and dirty and there’s no attempt at the story aspect. It’s just wall-to-wall sex. Most of it, again, is catered to an audience of men and it’s men with unlimited dreams of power who get to use women as toys. One of the benevolent aspects of sex [films] today is that because the means of production have gotten cheaper many more people can make their own and garner access to a market. They can find their market whether that’s lesbian porn, SM porn, shoe fetish porn. Whatever your craziness is, you can find someone making movies about it. In my day, you couldn’t necessarily, there were maybe 30 to 40 movies made a year. Now there’s 12,000 to 15,000 a year.

    What do you think about the current debate over condoms in porn?

    I applaud people who are trying to save their lives. I think it’s ridiculous to risk your life for a buck. The people who are making the money out of this aren’t risking their lives, it’s the actors who are put at risk. I’m a big fan of choice. I think the performer should have a choice. The sad truth of the economics of it is that people who are making sex scenes with condoms are making less money than people who are making sex scenes without them. We’re talking about a business here, we’re not talking about a social movement or a religion. It’s a dollar-driven industry. Once the businessmen see that condom sex isn’t making the same amount of money, fuck condom sex. And that’s why I’m not in the business. That’s the initial reason I got out. People would say, “No condoms” and “Forget about AIDS.” I was resented for even talking about it on sets I was on. The first headline of the heterosexual transmission of AIDS in San Francisco was November 10th, 1984. I was newly married with babies; it was not a time to play russian roulette with my dick.

    Would you say AIDS is why you retired, then?

    Yeah. There was pressure coming from my wife to get out as well, but that was a conventional kind of pressure that dealt with the fact that we had children and her ability to be gracious about me having other lovers was disappearing. She had stopped doing that stuff in her life.

    This is admittedly a tired question for porn performers, but: How did you tell your kids?

    There was a very famous sex therapist named Mary Calderone, who argued initially that sex education doesn’t mean teaching 10-year-olds the positions of the “Kama Sutra.” She argued that you need to be age-appropriate with what you’re teaching. So, it first came up with the phone, because the phone would ring for Richard Pacheco and I had to teach Juliana, and then Polly, and later Bobby, “When the phone rings for Richard Pacheco, don’t hang up. That’s a name that Daddy uses when he’s making movies.”  They would ask, “Daddy makes movies? Can we see ‘em, can we see ‘em?” “No, they’re grown-up movies.”

    Round two was one day, Polly was 10 and just out of nowhere turns to me and says, “What makes them grown-up movies? Do you mean like ‘Silence of the Lambs’?” And I said, “No, no, no, not like that.” And she said, “Well, what makes them grown-up? Sex?” It was just so perfectly right on that there was nothing to say but, “Yeah.” So Polly starts jumping up and down: “Daddy makes sexy movies, Daddy makes sexy movies!”

    I have to ask: When directing our school plays, did you ever worry that you would be outed as a porn star? That the other parents would try to burn you at the stake?

    If it had come I’d have dealt with it. It happened in Little League. When Bobby was 11, I walked onto the field one day and the coach called me over and said, “There’s gonna be trouble today. One of the mothers on the other team knows who you are.” He said, “I of course knew who you were the second you came on the field, and I want to tell you personally that anybody that’s been inside Nina Hartley’s booty is okay with me.” And nothing further came of it.

    • mark c 10:01 am on November 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      That was I believe the best article I ever read about the “Business” . There was no excuse my language but best word I can come up with There was none of the normal Bull Shit that most porn people add to there stories. It appears this guy really told you a true story from the heart and not in the process of the interview get sidetracked trying to sell you anything such as movies or web sites or anti-porn bandwagon goals .

      • John W 5:12 pm on November 28, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        I enjoyed the article too, Mark. The article was succinct yet covered many areas. However, the image of the director giving on set commands reminded me of my ex-wife (“In, out…in!”) LOL

    • Mark C 4:34 am on December 1, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      John W
      reminded me of my ex-wife (“In, out…in!”) LOL
      You just about caused me falling out of my seat laughing on that one.

    • Brandy 7:15 pm on December 10, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      This was great, thanks.

    • localarts 11:21 am on December 11, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I wonder what the Christmas atmosphere was like at 8763? Probably no tree or anything associated with the Christmas holiday. Wasn’t it Christmas day 1980 that Holmes sold Dawn Schiller for dope to Nash?

      • John 12:08 pm on December 11, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Yes, it was Xmas 1980. Joy was Jewish, so who knows but their holiday parties were probably pretty epic. I wonder if they had a tree… or just a Festivus Pole.

    • localarts 2:13 pm on December 11, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I bet Ronnie would have gotten pretty upset if someone had given him a microwave as a Christmas gift!

  • John 11:18 am on November 26, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: mcneil island prison,   

    McNeil Island Corrections Center 

    Of course, this is where Ron served his 3 year federal smuggling sentence. It’s near Seattle. There are all types of McNeil videos on YouTube, but this one was produced shortly after Ron’s release…and discusses the closure of the prison. Thus you get a better vibe for the era, along with some valuable imagery. You may read more posts about McNeil here.

    Ah yes, and I have requested Ron’s prison records via Federal Prisons in D.C. However, by the time I receive the records, I am certain that I will have forgotten that I even sent away for them. At a minimum, we will at least know the dates of his confinement. It all depends on how lazy the clerk is that day who opens the letter.

    Today’s vault presentation aired September 10, 1979, when the penitentiary was well on the way to being closed. We took a look at the history of the prison as well as its possible future.


    • localarts 2:14 pm on November 26, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      “It all depends on how lazy the clerk is that day who opens the letter” In that case it may be never. You know, they could have made the prisoners swim to McNeil island if they were serious about reducing cost.

      • John 2:49 pm on November 26, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        What sucks is that post-1982, the basic profile records are online for federal inmates. Missed it by a few years!!

        • localarts 4:55 pm on November 26, 2013 Permalink

          Damn. Pre 82…microfiche? Just a guess.

    • Mark C 3:47 pm on November 26, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Little off subject but I do sometimes feel sorry for you. I bet trying keep all of us up to date with all the new – latest details of this crime, I bet sometimes you feel like you are a zoo keeper trying to feed a cage full of real hungry lions..
      Oh well you I think are one happy zoo keeper anyway.
      Just let you know some of us think about your feelings anyway and it got to be a tough job at times.
      But some of us really appreciate all your hard work.

      • John 7:42 am on November 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Localarts is right, Mark. And there are many positives to few negatives. Readers here are really nice compared to other boards. Also, a few cats with peripheral or direct knowledge sometimes send in cool stuff.! Like the post coming here in a minute! Thanks again.

    • localarts 6:42 pm on November 26, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I believe John would tell you it’s a labor of love.

    • jim ---Chicago 11:11 am on November 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I wonder if Ronnie was a bad ass without a gun did he call shots in his cell block he was kinda small
      I think around 165 lbs

    • localarts 7:08 pm on November 27, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I think Ronnie was actually closer to 140. I doubt it unless he had Bruce Lee type skills!

      • jim ---Chicago 10:24 am on November 28, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        I assume he was more of a scrapper not the toughest not the weakest either but someone you should not turn your back on . His eyes are piercing and he probably got by on intimidation and reputation you know not afraid to shoot ,stab or go to jail . As for military service I think Holmes in the army had more training in hand to hand combat than Ronnie I mean he was in the air force I think Holmes was a lot bigger I cant see how he let Ronnie push him around I guess he did not want to screw up that connection but I guess size isnt everything ever see that movie from the late 70s or early 80s Scared Straight but Ronnie 140 lbs thats wild.

        • John W 4:09 pm on November 28, 2013 Permalink

          Indeed, Jim. A scrapper… And Ron’s size immediately reminds me of my older brother. Not a big man, but he has that look in his eye that persuades others not to test him.

      • criticextraordinaire 6:10 pm on November 29, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Ronnie was not huge but he was wiry. In prison he was no doubt in charge of his cell block. I’m thinking that the first guy to try anything with Ronnie served as the example as to why that would be a bad idea.

  • John 7:55 am on November 22, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: bob chinn,   

    Kilmer Talks To Bob Chinn About Holmes 

    At the end, Val gets a little snippy with his assistant.


    • Bobby 5:12 am on November 23, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Nice video… wonder what Chinn thought of Kilmer’s performance? I also remember seeing a similar video with Werner Herzog and Kilmer having a casual conversation on the same set of “Wonderland” as seen here.

      • Bobby 5:21 am on November 23, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Found it:

        Sorry but didn’t realise it was so short! I wonder what Herzog was doing on set that day?

    • Jill C. Nelson 7:06 am on November 23, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      This is a great clip! Bob isn’t the type of individual to be critical of anyone. He got along with Kilmer fairly well but admitted a few years back that Val didn’t really listen to his suggestions/advice and did his own spin on the character. Throughout a ten year working relationship and a couple of trips they made together, Chinn knew Holmes as well as anyone could have known him. Overall, I think Val’s interpretation was good.

      • John 7:53 am on November 26, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        I guess Val did a good job character wise, from what I know about John. But, I feel he just didn’t look enough like him. At all. So, when watching that movie, I just see Val Kilmer. I have always felt a less famous actor, and one that looked more like John would have been better…that’s just me.

  • John 10:31 am on November 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: maggie coffman, ,   

    Paul Kelly & Maggie Coffman – 1990 Article 

    Saturday morning, I hope to interview Chris Cox, club owner and peripheral player to the Wonderland saga.

    In the meantime, I have not posted this one before. The “red herring”, as Nils Grevillius called it. Right on. I’m no lawyer, but isn’t all this stuff from Maggie just hearsay? After what Billy’s son told me, Paul Kelly was the world’s biggest douche-bag. I wonder what happened to him.

    A few quotes from Billy’s son. We spoke 3 weeks ago:

    Like so many others in this story, “Paul Kelly came from money”. He “always had new threads and a nice car”. He and Billy were friends from “way back”. Paul dated Joy at one time, and that is how Billy met her. And…. Paul once took a dump after a party at the house on either Joy or her daughter’s birthday cake as a joke. Email the blog for more!


    April 17, 1990 | Section: NEWS | Edition: Valley | Associated Press

    A witness called by attorneys for two men charged in the murders of four people in Laurel Canyon told police in 1981 that another man gave her details of how the crime was committed, according to evidence introduced in court Monday.

    In a tape-recorded interview with police on July 3, 1981, the witness, Maggie Coffman, told police that Paul Kelly was in a “cheerful mood” as he described how the murders had taken place two days before.

    “He’s laughing about it, and he goes, ‘The only one we hated to see go was Billy (DeVerell),” Coffman said, referring to one of the victims in the July 1, 1981, killings.

    Coffman also told police that Kelly described where each of the victims had been killed in the Wonderland Avenue house, saying “We worked our way up. Ronnie (Launius) was one of the first to go.”

    She also quoted Kelly as saying, “I could tell you things that could curl your hair.”

    Coffman was called to the stand by attorneys for Eddie Nash and Gregory Diles, who hope to prove their clients are not guilty of the murders and lay blame on Kelly.

    Nash, whose real name is Adel Nasrallah, 61, and Diles, 41, are charged with the murders of Launius, 37; DeVerell, 42; Joy Audrey Miller, 46; and Barbara Richardson, 22, in what police claim was retaliation for a million- dollar robbery two days earlier at Nash’s Studio City home.

    • criticextraordinaire 3:19 pm on November 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Taking a dump on the birthday cake… That’s gangsta.

    • criticextraordinaire 5:50 pm on November 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      By the way John, can you ask some questions about the Lavender Hill Mob? I’ve not been able to find out much about them on the web. Keep getting hits on some movie from 1951. LOL.

      • John 7:32 am on November 22, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Yeah sure. I also hate when I’m searching for something and it has a similar name to some unrelated crap.

    • localarts 6:16 pm on November 21, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      I think I have deja vu. I remember this story from way way back when. There was also an accompanying story about police (could be Lange & Souza) having to track Coffman down in Bakersfield. That’s where things start to get kinda crazy with the Launius, Kelly, Coffman thing. Kelly told Coffman he had to kill someone she loved ( Launius ). Paul Kelly was in prison at the time Nash stood trial and when Kelly was subpoenaed he took the 5th

      If Kelly had nothing to do with it, then why the hell would he put himself at the scene of the crime and then invoke the 5th?

      • John 7:48 am on November 22, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        I know, he might have been blowing smoke. I searched my posts and the only thing I found about this topic was you telling me about it local arts. I’m just now slowly tracking down the articles. More soon, hopefully. I would love to see pics of these two star-crossed lovers.

        • Alex 11:12 pm on December 17, 2013 Permalink

          I saw the ending of the movie the other night on TV. It brought back memories. I knew Ron at the time of his death. It does not surprise me but the police did not do a through investigation at the time. Ron had a girl friend that has never been brought to light. She was suppose to be at the house that night but had to cancel. Ron and his wife were not on good terms nor was she at good terms with the other house members. I had heard the same thing as Coffman. I was told Susan was the one who let them in because she was mad at Ron. I was told at the time to keep my mouth shut so I did. The police never investigated Ron’s other girlfriend nor where he was prior to the break in at the Nash residence. Interesting huh? I had always wanted to say something but was warned not to get involved. As for Holmes I believe he just wanted the notoriety but wasn’t thinking how messed up that was going to be. Never heard his name mentioned before the murders.

        • Sheila 9:33 am on December 18, 2013 Permalink

          Since you knew Ron and you were told to keep quiet, was there ever a time that you were afraid that Nash would try to take out any one that had knowledge of ANY YHING about that house or about that night. I can’t imagine the fear and shock and disbelief of the community at that time. These people had no remote regard for human life and that was evident in the crime scene.

          Is is also true that Susan and Ron were police informants before going down South in CA?

        • Alex 5:50 pm on December 18, 2013 Permalink

          At the time I didn’t know anything about Nash. Didn’t know that Ron had committed the robbery. I only knew from my friend and someone else to keep my mouth shut. His girlfriend was very scared and I respected her request. Her house was broken into shortly after and she moved immediately, so I believe she knew more than she shared with me. When that happened I also did not want too much contact with her or her other close friends. I am sure if she reads this she will know who is writing this. She has never spoken of this since. I would read bits and pieces, sometimes she would tell me how the thing was unfolding. She at one point told me the Holmes thing was a joke, maybe he helped set up the Nash house, because he wanted a part in the money but he had nothing to do with letting the murders into the house.

          As for Susan, everyone feels sorry for her but she and Ron were not getting along and she was jealous of his new girlfriend. The fact that she was not killed like the others, lead others to believe she let the murders in, she was staying downstairs. I had never been to the house so I didn’t know the layout. Everyone knew she was going to have memory loss that way it kept her free and clear, she looked like a victim. All people feel sorry for her and she skated.

          Sheila, murder cases are never closed until they are solved.

        • Sheila 9:50 am on December 19, 2013 Permalink

          I think I read somewhere that Sharon Holmes had battled breast cancer and in 2006 or 2007 she moved in with Dawn and she took care of her. I am thinking Sharon died because the picture of her was not one of her looking very healthy.

      • John 10:54 am on November 22, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Here’s some more from another news summary, LA Times:

        The three trials exposed the seamy underside of Hollywood as few other courtroom dramas ever have. The accused included [John C. Holmes], [Gregory Diles], a 300-pound bouncer and bodyguard, who lost over 100 pounds in jail, and [Eddie Nash]. Nash, whose birth name is Adel Nasrallah, was an owner of striptease joints and Hollywood nightclubs. He spent more than two years in jail in the mid-1980s on narcotics charges.

        Two of the jurors said the defense case was so compelling that they would like to see [Paul Kelly] put on trial for the murders. Another said that while defense evidence against Kelly raised doubts about the guilt of Nash and Diles, it might not be sufficient to convict Kelly.

        Killed were William DeVerell, 44; his girlfriend, Joy Audrey Miller, 46, and Ronald Launius, 37, of Sacramento. All three had been involved in a robbery of Nash two days before in which large amounts of cash, jewels, narcotics and some guns were taken. The prosecution contended that the murders were ordered by Nash in retaliation for that robbery.

    • localarts 2:01 pm on November 22, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      So many moving parts to Wonderland & so many suspects coming in all directions. How did Paul Kelly know Ron Launius was one of the first ones to die, which I believe he was. Remember, Kelly told Coffman about the murders almost immediately after it happened.

      • John 2:32 pm on November 22, 2013 Permalink | Reply

        Paul Kelly might have been one of the first people to walk thru the house that morning, like so many others apparently did. That’s how he knew the locations and how soon he knew about it. Also, if 4-5 killers were present, the victims were all beaten at the same time. 2 men to each room, while Diles or Holmes took care of Barbara. I bet they were out of there in 20 mins.

        • Sheila 3:03 pm on December 17, 2013 Permalink

          John I thought I remembered hearing that there were only 3 people who entered the house but maybe that was the Nash robbery. I couldn’t see how 3 people could kill 4 people without someone getting away and calling for help. Where do Kelly and Coffman fit into this? I have read so much I can’t keep it all straight.

        • John 8:08 am on December 18, 2013 Permalink

          Yes, there is a lot to digest. But, investigator Nils Grevillius stated that a witness at Nash’s (a woman) said that 5 men were dispatched to the house: Holmes, Diles, Diles brother Samuel, Joe McLean (aka Hovsep Mikaelian) and another Armenian mob guy named Bulrashian (or Bulragian).

        • Sheila 9:23 am on December 18, 2013 Permalink

          It is so sad that Susan was the only one that survived and due to her horrific brain injury was unable to identify anyone. It is my feeling that they may have thought that even is she did survive her injuries would be so substantial she would never be right again.
          I saw where a blogger asked where Lind was. According to Wikipedia he died of a drug overdose in 1995

        • Sheila 12:33 pm on December 18, 2013 Permalink

          I am guessing that after all the time that has passed since the murders, it is pretty much a closed case now and if they did suspect any one else they are probably dead by now. You live by the sword you die by the sword

    • localarts 5:03 pm on November 22, 2013 Permalink | Reply

      Good observation. Thats probably the case.

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